Monday, August 17, 2015

Abortion Arguments

A combination of the Planned Parenthood videos and the presidential race brings some of the best anti-abortion news we've seen for a long time.  We hear candidates making very good arguments against abortion, taking some very conservative, completely scriptural positions.  While on the road yesterday, I heard the impact of this in a discussion on a PBS station.  The tide has turned on this.  A big part of it has also been the use of "science."  What the Bible says is science, but I'm saying that even those claiming to be pro-science struggle with the new emphasis against abortion.

Marco Rubio makes great arguments against abortion to Chris Cuomo on CNN, even in the case of rape and incest.  Rubio argues, of course the baby in the womb is a person, What else is it?  The only possible outcome is a person, not a dog or an elephant or anything else.  Ben Carson says that Margaret Sanger tried to eliminate black babies and that Planned Parenthood locates in black neighborhoods to cull the population.  Carly Fiorina talks about a doctor with the mother, using the ultrasound, referring to the child as a "baby."  They don't say it's a fetus.  They refer to it a baby.  The ultrasound visits have changed minds.  Prenatal surgery "saves the baby's life."  It's hard to say that anything but a person was saved through a prenatal surgery.  Ben Carson performed these.

Ray Comfort presents an argument.  If you were to destroy a skyscraper and you knew there was one person in the building, would you go ahead and destroy it?  No one would.  If there was even a slight possibility that someone was in the building, maybe hidden in some closet, would you?  No.  If it was less than 1 percent chance someone was in the building, would you still destroy it? No.  If there is one percent chance that life starts at conception, would you kill it?  Good argument.

I thought of another one.  At what point would scientists call something life if they found it on Mars? If they found it, would they kill it?  To the extent that that is life, is that in the mother's womb more life after conception?  Would they kill something that is more living than what they found on Mars?  I'm not saying they would find that on Mars, but I'm quite sure that something less than a conceived human being, they would protect, try to save.

If someone dies when his heart stops beating, is he alive when his heart starts beating?  The heart in the womb is already beating.  The Bible is against abortion.  We can go to the verses, but you can argue from morality, even natural law, the common sense, the law written in the hearts of unbelievers.  I hear this moving the argument against abortion even in this pagan society or culture like I haven't seen it in awhile.  This is good news.


George Calvas said...

In contrast to your last subject that did nothing to help the body of Christ it is best that you just stick to writing about subjects such as these because you actually teach good things to the body of Christ that can be used in the context of scripture to preach and teach, making disciples of men.

Farmer Brown said...

Since we have had so much Ruckman in the past few week, please pardon me if I bring him back up. He belong in any discussion on abortion.

"I teach that a baby is not a living soul until it breathes. I'm considered a great heretic for teaching that, but then again if a man goes by the King James Bible he's bound to be a heretic these days. And so I don't teach that abortion is murder like the brethren do and for that reason I'm considered a heretic by some of the brethren.

"But I'm an old dog, I've been around a long time, you know what I've observed? I've observed that Pharisees always worryin' about matters of sex. "Is it lawful for a man to put away his wife for every cause?" "Master, there was a certain man and left a wife and his brother married her" it's a strange kinda thing. Some of the brethren are kinda, I think they're sex obsessional neurotics and they've signed[?] all their Bible teaching [incomprehensible mumbling] is a floozy, man I don't know where they're at. I know what it is, must be kind of a form of Pharisee-ism ....[tangent about short skirts, and jabs at those who make an issue of them]... Some of the brethren get so hung up on these things you know, they say, 'Abortion is murder; abortion is murder.'

"They show you pictures. Well they're trying to prove, they're trying to prove that thing looks like a person, it is a person. That's what Darwin taught. You gotta watch that business. You can take an embryo of an animal and prove that it looks like an embryo of a person. That doesn't make it a person. You gotta watch that business. You go out and starting to prove that this is a person before that thing is born, then you got that matter of salvation and the first thing you know they'll be up there at that Catholic hospital dumpin' water on 'em so they don't go to limbo. You gotta watch that kind of stuff.

"Now I'll grant you the child is an organism, I'll grant you that. There's a lot of organisms. I'll grant you the child may be alive in the sense of animal life, I'll grant you that. I'll grant you it's an embryo, I'll grant you that. But if you're talking about a living soul, see, I read my Bible, there is no living soul there until the Lord breathed into his nostrils the breath of life.

"Now when you smack that baby and that baby goes "gwahhh!" ya you can't blame a kid for yelling, look what he's coming into. And when that kid yelled, as far as I'm concerned, then a living soul. Now if you ever start teaching the other, and maybe some of you fellows subscribe[?] that way, you are going to have some real problems. When all those Indians and Hindus came into Bangladesh and Pakistan and raped about 2000 women and left them with about 800 illegitimate children, the good Catholic nuns, in order to increase the membership to the local church, decided it'd be a terrible sin to have any abortion. So the will of God for 800 women who were abused against their will to bear children for the Roman Catholic Church.

"I don't believe it! Then ya talkin' like this, and folks say "When you get talking like this, then the libertines say 'Well, then abortion is alright, therefore...' and take advantage of it", you see, I won't compromise the truth whether you take advantage of it or whether you don't. Alright and if someone takes advantage of the truth I just gave, that lies between them and the Lord, but I feel the truth is the truth no matter what you do with it..."

This is the man described by many as the worlds best Bible teacher.

George Calvas said...

" But if you're talking about a living soul, see, I read my Bible, there is no living soul there until the Lord breathed into his nostrils the breath of life."

That is nonsense. That living soul had to do with God's creation alone of man once. That has nothing to do with man's procreation that the Lord God created as part of his design.

He understood wrong about the bibles teaching in this area, just like some of you that teach on biblical inspiration. Does that mean that I throw out all the rest of what you say concerning spiritual matters when they glorify the truth?

Farmer Brown said...

George wrote, "He understood wrong about the bibles teaching in this area, just like some of you that teach on biblical inspiration. Does that mean that I throw out all the rest of what you say concerning spiritual matters when they glorify the truth?"

Some men think it is fine before God for women to wear pants as long as they are modest. Peter Ruckman thinks it's fine before God to murder a child by driving scissors into his skull and sucking out his brains.

Do you not see the difference? To answer your questions, Yes, if the source believes in and defends child murder, throw out the rest of what he says. To quote the worlds greatest Bible teacher, "You gotta watch that business."

KJB1611 said...

Dear Farmer,

Thanks for the great info.